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#1 2020-09-23 09:27:00

rhhsmits
Member
Registered: 2020-08-13
Posts: 11

Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

A very limited number of rules already exist for naming roads in Wikiproject Bulgaria, see https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Bg: … 0.B4.D0.B8. I would like to discuss with you to expand this set with these:

1. to define how road names other than ул. need to be abbreviated: булевард = бул., площад = пл., ...

2. for highway=motorway, not to use Автомагистрала in the name, so Автомагистрала Тракия => Тракия

3. not to use the road number as the name (there's a separate tag for that), unless the road number is actually used as a name locally.

4. I noticed that many tracks and paths, especially in the mountains, are named,for instance "Kamenitza - Staria chark", "Кладова - Велинград през Печенек", "черен път до с. Иваново", "х.Партизанска Песен - х.Мазалат". These are not names of these paths, but descriptions, so it is in disagreement with the description of the Name key "The names should be restricted to the name of the item in question only and should not include additional information not contained in the official name such as categories, types, descriptions, addresses, refs, or notes. " I've been deleting these names, but am now wondering if there is an agreement between Bulgarian mappers to do this. I propose not to use descriptions as names, but to use the Description tag for that. However, it should be used as the name of relations that link paths that form part of a marked hiking route. In this way, apps that use OSM can still render the "name" of the path (I'm using Backcountry Navigator, which renders the relation "Kom - Emine" as KE along the path), while a search, for instance for "х. Мазалат" will only result in the hut, and not all the paths that lead to it.

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#2 2020-09-25 15:11:36

saintam1
Member
Registered: 2014-11-09
Posts: 27

Re: Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

This all makes sense to me. In your #4 I think the name should go on the route relation.

Regarding #1 it's worth reminding ourselves that the Bulgarian tagging standard for names is in contradiction to the best practice described on the wiki: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nam … reviations -- to be in line with that we should actually use full prefixes, e.g. "улица Еди-коя-си" and "булевард Еди-кой-си". But it's probably more important that at least we be consistent with ourselves within Bulgaria, and I'm not proposing that we change that now.

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#3 2020-09-27 11:53:25

BollWeevil
Member
Registered: 2012-11-12
Posts: 57

Re: Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

It was my initiative, a few years ago, it's here in the forum, to try at least to make the street naming in Bulgarian a bit more consistent, as back then it was mindbogglingly diverse. The exact convention was not that important for me, and ultimately my first proposal was not accepted, but it was important to have one convention and we got it. Most of the country adheres to it now. So, we've come quite a long way since, but all the points above are very valid.

My comments:
1. Currently, we abbreviate "бул.", not sure we have any consistency on "площад". I understand the general recommendation not to abbreviate (I did not not notice a rule to actually write "street"), but I'd recommend not to change it for boulevard. And definitely not change the convention for streets now.
2. 100% agree On second thought, everyone calls them "Автомагистрала so and so". It is basically part of the name. I'd keep it.
3. 100% agree
4. As @saintam1 also stated, the name should be in the relation, not the path itself. So the 3 of us seem to be in agreement on this, too.

I will be happy if a few more members join in here with their feedback and comments (the more, the better - as it is more representative). And then we add this to the Wiki and change it in the data, where needed, so that other people follow the example.

Last edited by BollWeevil (2020-09-27 19:03:09)

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#4 2020-09-30 14:02:17

rhhsmits
Member
Registered: 2020-08-13
Posts: 11

Re: Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

1. So maybe we should not abbreviate булевард, площад, ... but not using улица in the street name is not against any Openstreetmap rule, isn't it? It's often shown on a separate line on the street sign, so we could claim it's not part of the name.
2. It's not very important, as there aren't many of them.
3. I think it's obvious that this should be a rule, but it should be mentioned as it's often violated.
4. I'd like to hear the arguments of people who've been doing this, as I wouldn't want to destroy what must have been a lot of work.

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#5 2020-10-26 08:52:49

plamen
Member
Registered: 2011-08-15
Posts: 87

Re: Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

Just for the record - previous discussion in this forum, in Bulgarian language.

@rhhsmits
1. Starting with questions. What define names? A signboard posted on the building? Documents in the community administration? Official maps? Where are these official maps? In case of any discrepancies (and believe me there are many in our country), what would be with priority for us?
For now, we have some agreement in the wiki about the streets.
Regarding boulevards (and 'ploshtads') we need some kind of differentiation. Otherwise, we will end in routing applications with 'Васил Левски' and nothing more. At the same time all local people will know that piece of asphalt as 'булевард Васил Левски'. Since 'булевард' is too long it is usually abbreviated, so do we. We do not abbreviate 'Васил' as 'В.', etc.
There is no other way to include the word 'boulevard' in OSM, and this is important for us.
There are no other type of streets in Bulgaria like 'avenue', 'проспект', etc. (for motorways - see item 2 below)
For town squares, so-called 'площад'-s, my proposal is to proceed in the same way as with boulevards: 'пл. Някой_си'

Side note about quotation marks: They are compulsory as per official rules when writing someone's address. Official rules written back in the 70-ties say nothing about Open Street Map smile

2. Motorways... Yes, they have names in Bulgaria, where motorways exist at all.
'Автомагистрала' is too long, some routing apps may not accommodate the whole name like 'Автомагистрала Черно Море', but abbreviation 'AM' is also not so common. On the other hand, ways are tagged as 'motorways', so we do not need to enter the same information twice. Routing software could add 'Магистрала ' in the front of the name (remaining name), based on 'highway=motorway'.

3 & 4 - Fully agree. Somebody should edit the wiki of course.

Last edited by plamen (2020-10-26 15:59:21)

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#6 2020-11-13 11:42:32

rhhsmits
Member
Registered: 2020-08-13
Posts: 11

Re: Road naming rules in (Wikiproject) Bulgaria

!. There are some general guidelines and good practices: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Good_practice mentions "Map what's on the ground" so what's on the street name sign should be on the map, however https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nam … t_do_it.29 even if there are abbreviations on the street name sign. Shouldn't we adapt this for Bulgaria too?
3&4 - Can you do it (I'm not a native speaker)?

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