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#1 2019-08-13 13:38:04

woodpeck
Member
Registered: 2009-12-02
Posts: 869

Forest import

Hi,

I have just blocked user posiki_import_forest in https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3103 with a request to please discuss their import here or in another channel with the Finnish community. I could not immediately find any such discussion, and an endeavour of such magnitude clearly mandates discussion. I might of course have overlooked a discussion that has been going on.

I have randomly checked some of the imported forest polygons against aerial imagery and found many to be not matching the imagery (but this could also be outdated imagery). Many of the imported polygons had totally artificial "wobbly" and over-noded outlines e.g. the southern edge of this

https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/71337 … 7/24.87802

is a very clean curve along the road, and not a 30-node wobbly line. The imported objects carry a source tag on the object rather than on the changeset.

I don't think that the methodology used here - documented here https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Fin … 9_Creation - is sufficiently honed to roll it out for all of Finland but I would defer to the Finnish community for that.

Bye   
Frederik

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#2 2019-08-13 14:10:00

posiki
Member
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 208
Website

Re: Forest import

Hi Frederik,

Yes, we can have discussion inside Finnish community about this forest creation.

Rgs,

P

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#3 2019-09-01 02:38:40

Zaltys
Member
Registered: 2019-09-01
Posts: 4

Re: Forest import

Good. This has done more than enough damage already.

It seems to work acceptably well in areas that have already been mapped almost perfectly. But in areas that remain unmapped, especially ones with missing buildings and roads, at most 10% seem to be drawn correctly.

Gardens and parks, scrubs, grassland, fields, often even pavement and buildings - all now marked as forest. This needs to be completely reverted, because manually fixing all of these messes is wasting too much time and it's sapping all my will to continue contributing to OSM. Not to mention that it has made the map useless for navigation in remote regions: undermapped is still helpful for getting around, but when there's nothing but incorrectly mapped forests everywhere... that's completely useless.

Last edited by Zaltys (2019-09-01 07:23:35)

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#4 2019-09-01 04:26:42

Zaltys
Member
Registered: 2019-09-01
Posts: 4

Re: Forest import

Look at this, for example:
B9nYUWv.jpg

The blob on top left is clearly not forest. Neither is the one at bottom right. And the two drawn on the top of river are better tagged as scrub, not forest.

And from what I've seen, there's literally thousands of such blobs all over the map.

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#5 2019-09-01 08:30:49

Zaltys
Member
Registered: 2019-09-01
Posts: 4

Re: Forest import

Then there's places like this:
o1t3ouU.jpg

I was just trying to map the area, but then ran into that. And trying to untangle it is taking forever.

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#6 2019-09-02 20:00:53

Hadena
Member
Registered: 2018-09-08
Posts: 5

Re: Forest import

I also hope this change is reverted. It's good to add more landcover, but now everything turned into weirdly shaped forests.

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#7 2019-09-08 14:48:54

posiki
Member
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 208
Website

Re: Forest import

Hi!

We have also separated discussion in Finnish: https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=67102.

Rgs,

P

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#8 2019-09-08 14:50:20

posiki
Member
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 208
Website

Re: Forest import

Zaltys wrote:

that's completely useless.

Ok, I agree that you disagree.

Just post / describe areas where I revert this automatic creation and I will fix those.

Rgs,

P

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#9 2019-09-08 14:52:57

posiki
Member
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 208
Website

Re: Forest import

Hadena wrote:

I also hope this change is reverted.

Hi,

I will gladly revert forests of those areas, which you will take care of later on. Please describe municipality and/or map sheets and I will clear those areas.

Rgs,

P

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#10 2019-09-08 15:22:59

posiki
Member
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 208
Website

Re: Forest import

woodpeck wrote:

I would defer to the Finnish community for that.

So far, 8 people has commented this Forest creation task. 2 opposite, 6 favor (+ me).

If we are following person / vote -method, over 75% of Finnish community members (who have said their opinion) agree that this good thing to do.

Rgs,

P

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#11 2019-09-10 18:40:52

Zaltys
Member
Registered: 2019-09-01
Posts: 4

Re: Forest import

posiki wrote:
Zaltys wrote:

that's completely useless.

Ok, I agree that you disagree.

Just post / describe areas where I revert this automatic creation and I will fix those.

Far too many to list.
Would be easier to list the places that don't need to be fixed. I've already manually fixed or deleted literally hundreds if not thousands of these messes, and there's countless more wherever I scroll the map.

J5FX99Q.jpg
ZWDR21w.jpg
fGLzp7F.jpg(Funny how it drew a forest in the only spot where there are no trees.)

The whole country is like that now, except for cities and residential areas which were already zoned. This project may have mapped the missing forests (though with weird curvy lines), but it made a complete mess of places where people are likely to use maps: residential areas.

Did you actually test this at all before running it? Did you check the results to see if it's working correctly? If this had been limited to larger blobs and had less smoothing, it would've likely worked quite nicely.

Last edited by Zaltys (2019-09-13 03:56:49)

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