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#1 2019-03-30 14:58:40

Beddhist
Member
From: Doembang Nangbuat, TH
Registered: 2009-07-28
Posts: 435
Website

Help needed splitting the Moei River

It has just been pointed out to me that the Moei river does not have a source. It starts being called the Moei at the confluence of the Mègala River/Gawli Chaung from Burma and the Huai Walae (Wa Le). In OSM and Wikipedia the entire river is called Moei. A mapper had this confirmed by a local resident.

There is a dearth of online info on Burmese and Thai rivers, at least in English.

What I have found so far:

Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moei_River

GeoHack - Gawli Chaung: https://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geoha … i%20Chaung

This has a link to a non-existent Wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megala_River

Geonames has the Mègala River: http://www.geonames.org/1149943/gawli-chaung.html

But in a bizarre twist it has allocated all its alternate names to the Huai Walae: http://www.geonames.org/1149943/gawli-chaung.html

Interesting, both perma links are the same, but they show as two distinct items on the map. Looks like data corruption.

I was all set to correct this on OSM, but the Moei is also an international boundary and the way is member of several relations. All this is way over my head and so I would like somebody to fix this please.

Thanks in advance.
Regards,
Peter.

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#2 2019-03-30 16:42:55

AlaskaDave
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From: Homer, Alaska ; Chiang Mai
Registered: 2013-09-21
Posts: 433
Website

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

Peter,

I'll have a look near the source but just now I realigned a longish section of the Moei River where it serves as a boundary between Thailand and Myanmar to check if my memory is correct. It is not actually part of the boundary relations in the places I'm familiar with, however, the two ways are right on top of one another. The Moei River way is underneath the complex boundary you referring to. However, the river is also part of two watershed relations but as long as you remember that if you delete a segment and then replace it, you need to add the new piece to those relations. Otherwise, they will break.

Dave

Later (edited),

I see the problem now. Yes, the river, the watersheds and many boundaries all share the same way down where the Mègala River enters. I could separate the river from the other relations but it would then have to be redrawn as a new way. I think I fiddled around looking for the source a couple of years ago but gave up because I simply did not know where that source was. If someone can pin down where the Huai Walae is, I will help with redrawing the river as a separate new way.

Could the Huai Walae be the river, incorrectly named Moei, that joins the Mègala River from the south?

Last edited by AlaskaDave (2019-03-30 17:03:26)

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#3 2019-03-31 08:56:26

Paul_012
Member
Registered: 2011-08-05
Posts: 210

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

Just commenting on the info—I probably won't be able to edit soon enough:

I've learned never to trust Geonames on anything.

The Royal Society Gazetteer's entry for the Moei reads:

แม่น้ำ เกิดจากแม่น้ำเมกาลา ในรัฐกะเหรี่ยง สาธารณรัฐแห่งสหภาพเมียนมาร์ ไหลมารวมกับห้วยวาเล่ย์ ที่เส้นแบ่งเขตแดนระหว่างประเทศไทยกับสาธารณรัฐแห่งสหภาพเมียนมาร์ ที่บ้านมอเกอไทย ต.วาเล่ย์ อ.พบพระ จ.ตาก แล้วไหลเป็นเส้นแบ่งเขตแดนระหว่างประเทศไทยกับสาธารณรัฐแห่งสหภาพเมียนมาร์ ผ่าน อ.พบพระ อ.แม่สอด อ.แม่ระมาด และ อ.ท่าสองยาง จ.ตาก เข้า อ.สบเมย จ.แม่ฮ่องสอน ไปลงแม่น้ำสาละวินที่บ้านสบเมย ต.สบเมย ยาว ๓๔๘ กม.

So the Moei originates at the confluence of the Mègala River (in Myanmar) and Huai Walae (which forms the upstream border; also note that it would be spelled Huai Wale according to RTGS transcription rules). The confluence is at Ban Mo Koe Thai in Tambon Wale, Amphoe Phop Phra, Tak Province.

English info on the border can be found in the US State Department's Internaitonal Boundary Study. It doesn't distinguish Huai Wale from the Moei, but the border should align with the former up to its headwaters at around 16°30' N.

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#4 2019-03-31 12:02:04

AlaskaDave
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From: Homer, Alaska ; Chiang Mai
Registered: 2013-09-21
Posts: 433
Website

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

Paul,

Thanks for the tip. The confluence of the Moei and Mègala Rivers is near a school tagged as Ban Mo Koe School. So I repeat my question: Can we assume that the river coming from the south to join the Moei at the Mègala River is the Huai Wale?

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#5 2019-03-31 13:45:18

Paul_012
Member
Registered: 2011-08-05
Posts: 210

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

AlaskaDave wrote:

Paul,

Thanks for the tip. The confluence of the Moei and Mègala Rivers is near a school tagged as Ban Mo Koe School. So I repeat my question: Can we assume that the river coming from the south to join the Moei at the Mègala River is the Huai Wale?

Yes, that would be it.

Interestingly though it aligns with the boundary only up to the point where Padee (Phadi) waterfall is tagged. Not sure if the upstream stream is still considered Huai Wale. Google Maps shows the stream that follows the boundary upstream from the waterfall as Kro Kro (กรอโกร), but I could hardly find any info on that name.

So we can safely say the length of water between Padee Waterfall and the confluence near Ban Mo Koe School is Huai Wale. I have no idea what the parts upstream from the waterfall are supposed to be called.

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#6 2019-03-31 15:23:47

AlaskaDave
Member
From: Homer, Alaska ; Chiang Mai
Registered: 2013-09-21
Posts: 433
Website

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

Okay, it's done.

I assumed the stream above the Padee Waterfall is also named Huai Wa Li - that may prove to be wrong at some future date but at this point, we have no better information. I separated the Moei River and Moei (Nujiang) basin from the boundary wherever they were joined. I duplicated that boundary from the confluence near Ban Mo Koe back to the falls, stripped its tags, removed it from the Moei and Moei (Nujiang) basin relations and used it to create the Huai Wa Li.

Cheers,

Dave

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#7 2019-04-01 13:37:56

Beddhist
Member
From: Doembang Nangbuat, TH
Registered: 2009-07-28
Posts: 435
Website

Re: Help needed splitting the Moei River

Thanks guys, much appreciated.

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