You are not logged in.

#51 2017-05-28 13:25:58

escada
Moderator
Registered: 2011-08-13
Posts: 1,609

Re: wikidata tag added to thousands of place nodes. Automated mass edit?

rmikke wrote:

One thing worries me, cause I may not understand wikidata correctly: Is it all right to have two wikidata entries pointing to the same wikipedia article?

I think that is possible. It is possible to describe a group of objects in Wikipedia (e.g. a museum and the paintings in it, while the painting might already be a separate Wikidata item.

Offline

#52 2017-05-28 15:53:29

Gotegomadi
Member
Registered: 2017-05-26
Posts: 99

Re: wikidata tag added to thousands of place nodes. Automated mass edit?

Just look at this map: https://a.safe.moe/3cC0P.png
This map entirely created from wikipedia data, no OSM at all.
Pointer at POI with text "Wikipedia: Messages about errors/Archive/2011/09"

Last edited by Gotegomadi (2017-05-28 15:53:50)


Пишу ненужный код для несуществующих задач

Offline

#53 2017-05-30 10:12:34

rmikke
Moderator
From: Warszawa
Registered: 2014-11-14
Posts: 1,690
Website

Re: wikidata tag added to thousands of place nodes. Automated mass edit?

escada wrote:
rmikke wrote:

One thing worries me, cause I may not understand wikidata correctly: Is it all right to have two wikidata entries pointing to the same wikipedia article?

I think that is possible. It is possible to describe a group of objects in Wikipedia (e.g. a museum and the paintings in it, while the painting might already be a separate Wikidata item.

If so, we should definitely add wikidata=* to wikipedia=* as automatically as possible, then hunt for doubled wikidata values and create additional wikidata entries for separate entities.

Offline

#54 2017-05-30 11:41:02

SomeoneElse
Member
Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 1,221

Re: wikidata tag added to thousands of place nodes. Automated mass edit?

rmikke wrote:

If so, we should definitely add wikidata=* to wikipedia=* as automatically as possible, then hunt for doubled wikidata values and create additional wikidata entries for separate entities.

That's what appears to have happened so far, and it has devalued the work that people have done adding valid wikidata entries.  Someone processing wikidata values in OSM would have to do some postprocessing:

"Was this tag added by someone who has added a _lot_ of wikidata links?  If so, I'd better ignore it".

The link between wikipedia and wikidata is already present in wikidata - simply duplicating it in OSM without any checking adds no value.  Adding wikidata links for which you have local knowledge _does_ add value.

Offline

#55 2017-05-30 15:36:21

rmikke
Moderator
From: Warszawa
Registered: 2014-11-14
Posts: 1,690
Website

Re: wikidata tag added to thousands of place nodes. Automated mass edit?

SomeoneElse wrote:
rmikke wrote:

If so, we should definitely add wikidata=* to wikipedia=* as automatically as possible, then hunt for doubled wikidata values and create additional wikidata entries for separate entities.

That's what appears to have happened so far, and it has devalued the work that people have done adding valid wikidata entries.  Someone processing wikidata values in OSM would have to do some postprocessing:

"Was this tag added by someone who has added a _lot_ of wikidata links?  If so, I'd better ignore it".

The link between wikipedia and wikidata is already present in wikidata - simply duplicating it in OSM without any checking adds no value.  Adding wikidata links for which you have local knowledge _does_ add value.

I think I don't understand.

Let's assume there is no mass adding. Then someone would have to:

  1. Incidentally find an object without wikidata

  2. Get an idea "Hey, it would be nice to add wikidata tag!"

  3. Make a research, which wikipedia article is correct (OK, let's assume wikipedia tag has a value for a start), does it have a wikidata entry and is this entry correct for OSM object or should new wikidata entry be created.

How fast, do you think, wikidata IDs will be added to OSM?

Now back to the current situation. with mass adding of wikidata IDs. Most OSM objects have correct wikidata IDs (everywhere there is a 1:1 OSM-Wikipedia relation) and all that has to be done is:

  1. Get duplicated values of wikidata e.g. from taginfo

  2. Make a research, if wikipedia article covers both OSM objects and for which OSM object the existing wikidata entry is correct

  3. Create wikidata entry for remaining OSM object(s)

And there are at least two people (nyuriks and me) dedicated for this and trying to clean up the wikidata issues.
Is there some postprocessing needed? Yes, there is, but not for every user - we will have to do this additional hunt for doubled wikidata entries.

SomeoneElse wrote:

The link between wikipedia and wikidata is already present in wikidata - simply duplicating it in OSM without any checking adds no value.  Adding wikidata links for which you have local knowledge _does_ add value.

YES! Not exactly. but yes. I even do think we should rely on wikidata more. But for that we need correct wikidata IDs. So I think it's bettter to add the IDs then resolve issues (and there are more than duplicate IDs, nyuriks has created a page that covers at least some of them and gets local help with the issues), than to not have them at all.

And the knowledge required is not exactly local. All the issues so far require knowledge of local:

  • language

  • rules

Otherwise it's totally armchair mapping. I could even correct some issues in China, with absolutely no understanding what I'm editing (after some Chinese guy assigned correct wikipedia articles instead of disambiguation, but left out the wikidata IDs).

So thanks for noticing the problem of duplicate wikidata IDs, we will take care of that, among other issues.

Offline

Board footer

Powered by FluxBB