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#26 2010-12-09 09:47:24

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

nafg wrote:

However, I didn't see an option for New Jersey. It seems to have about 45 states. Would it be possible to enable the others?

Hi nafg,
thanks for the first comment to USA/OSM data smile. I tried to convert it from planet101103.osm and there were couple boundary problems (see http://forum.mapfactor.com/discussion/5 … s-report/). I fixed some simple cases (or they were already fixed on-line), but not all yet. I tried New Jersey from planet101201.osm and the problem is still there. Give me some time to investigate the details ...
thanks Martin

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#27 2010-12-09 17:21:41

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

There are/were at least two problems with New Jersey/USA:
1) boundary - I added 3 ways to relation, hopefully it is correct (see changeset = '6595328')
2) there are several nodes exceeding limit per crossing:
ERROR - max expansion is over limit (25)
  id_junction:       922989537, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989506, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989507, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989540, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989510, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989545, expansion:  95
  id_junction:       922989514, expansion:  95
  id_junction:       922989549, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989518, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989552, expansion:  95
  id_junction:       922989522, expansion:  96
  id_junction:       922989539, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989529, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989532, expansion:  94
  id_junction:       922989534, expansion:  95
... fixed in changeset='6596235'and changeset='6596313'
now it passed preliminary tests so we will see tomorrow ...

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#28 2010-12-09 18:30:44

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

FYI usa_new_jersey_osm.mca was successfully created so you should see it after SYNC of servers tonight ...

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#29 2010-12-13 08:21:08

nafg
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Registered: 2010-12-09
Posts: 8

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Thanks a ton! I really appreciate it.

Some questions and comments:
1) What is the reason why it doesn't have address numbers?
2) If a change is made on OSM when can the map be updated?
3) It would be very helpful (especially considering that OSM maps may not be 100% correct, as I experienced today) if the voice would not only announce turn directions, but also street names.
4) I would like it better if instead of announcing and displaying distance in yards, it would use fractional miles (e.g., .5 miles). This way I can correlate the information with the car's odometer.
5) Another enhancement might be, at zoom levels that don't allow to fit street names inside the street lines, the name could be printed over it horizontally.

If I think of anything else I'll try to let you know.


Otherwise I'm very excited with it!

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#30 2010-12-13 09:58:58

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

1) What is the reason why it doesn't have address numbers?

The whole processing OSM->MCA is still in progress. We plan to integrate house numbers, but this issue is not straightforward. Hopefully it will be available by the beginning of year 2011.

2) If a change is made on OSM when can the map be updated?

At the moment the update period is approximately 2 months (it is still partially manual process). If you need update of some particular country let us know.

3) It would be very helpful (especially considering that OSM maps may not be 100% correct, as I experienced today) if the voice would not only announce turn directions, but also street names.

You can use this, but then you have to use computer generated voice: Settings>Application>English:Synthetized English (or Czech Robot). If you use Windows Vista you can get better voice quality by selection of "Windows default voice".


4) I would like it better if instead of announcing and displaying distance in yards, it would use fractional miles (e.g., .5 miles). This way I can correlate the information with the car's odometer.

I suppose you set US units? Do you use yards at all (say 100 yards)?

Thanks
   Martin

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#31 2010-12-14 01:55:50

nafg
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Registered: 2010-12-09
Posts: 8

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

mapfactor wrote:

You can use this, but then you have to use computer generated voice: Settings>Application>English:Synthetized English (or Czech Robot). If you use Windows Vista you can get better voice quality by selection of "Windows default voice".

Ah, but this is for Windows Mobile. Does that mean it's not possible with most devices? Besides the fact that most WM devices don't actually include the Speech API, I tried both "Locale Default" and "Synthetized English" and they didn't work; only MapFactor Lotta worked.
Recently I was looking for a free speech synthesizer for Windows Mobile, and the only one I found (besides FreeTTS which uses Java) was SmartRead Mobile TTS SDK (http://www.smartysoft.com/smmobile/sdk.html) which I downloaded but haven't actually tried.

Thanks!

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#32 2010-12-14 01:59:29

nafg
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Registered: 2010-12-09
Posts: 8

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

nafg wrote:
mapfactor wrote:

You can use this, but then you have to use computer generated voice: Settings>Application>English:Synthetized English (or Czech Robot). If you use Windows Vista you can get better voice quality by selection of "Windows default voice".

Ah, but this is for Windows Mobile. Does that mean it's not possible with most devices? Besides the fact that most WM devices don't actually include the Speech API, I tried both "Locale Default" and "Synthetized English" and they didn't work; only MapFactor Lotta worked.
Recently I was looking for a free speech synthesizer for Windows Mobile, and the only one I found (besides FreeTTS which uses Java) was SmartRead Mobile TTS SDK (http://www.smartysoft.com/smmobile/sdk.html) which I downloaded but haven't actually tried.

Thanks!

Actually now I'm not so sure it's free.

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#33 2010-12-14 11:30:18

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

nafg wrote:

Ah, but this is for Windows Mobile. Does that mean it's not possible with most devices? Besides the fact that most WM devices don't actually include the Speech API, I tried both "Locale Default" and "Synthetized English" and they didn't work; only MapFactor Lotta worked.

That's strange - "Synthetized English" should work for all: PC, PDA and PND (that's the reason why we did it, so it is not dependent on windows Speech API). Could you send me navigator.log.txt? Can somebody else confirm that behavior? (the latest tested version was 10.1.35)

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#34 2010-12-14 12:32:44

nm7s9
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Registered: 2008-08-15
Posts: 12

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Hi Martin,

Thanks for this application. I have just installed it (Garmin Nuvifone M10) and will do lots of testing in Canberra, Australia over the next few days.

I'm sure I will have a lot of questions and comments.

Cheers
Nick Hocking

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#35 2010-12-15 20:16:48

RGPS
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Registered: 2010-12-15
Posts: 15

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

me too, i use the Navigator 10 free to anticipate the reaction of Turn-by-Turn algorythm and take primary mesure to avoid the "turn left" when the road have % of degres and the right instruction is "turn right".

note: on WM6.5.2 (HTC Touch HD), the "locked" screen (to use the navigator on jacket with my bike)...the navigation process STOP immediatly if i haven't a starting point.

If i use the GPS coordonates and the final destination, then i lock (press OFF), the navigator don't help me.
If i does a starting point and the final destination and i "lock", the navigator work very good.

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#36 2010-12-16 13:58:52

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
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Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Hi RGPS, I am not sure what do you mean - some kind of a sleep mode of your device? (I suppose you are not talking about "Settings > GPS > Lock on target", when the Navigator only shows direction to your destination). The destination is necessary for navigation, but I do not see the need for departure ... we will try to reproduce it, thanks  Martin

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#37 2010-12-18 18:33:48

RGPS
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Registered: 2010-12-15
Posts: 15

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

the "lock" mode on HTC (Windows Mobile) is when you push the ON/OFF 1 time to "lock" the screen (touchscreen).
as normal way, the screen is "lock" to avoid touch on pocket ... and the screen go in "idle" mode (no display but OS alive to ring/email/SMS).

With the Navigator10, the screen is "only" locked and the screen doesn't go in "idle" mode.

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#38 2010-12-18 23:28:21

RGPS
Member
Registered: 2010-12-15
Posts: 15

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Question: I don't have the Japan OSM on list and on the world OSM... ? it's normal ?

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#39 2010-12-19 08:09:39

Hwy101
Member
Registered: 2010-12-17
Posts: 6

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Thanks to Stephan75 for the Mapfactor Wiki page & Martin his Post & Fielding questions.

Martin, do you want questions about Mapfactor use here (for exposure) or is there another site to use?

Thanks

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#40 2010-12-19 18:08:11

marcinz
Member
Registered: 2010-12-19
Posts: 1

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

@mapfactor:

For last 3 weeks I have been looking for any map of Martinique. Finally I've found OSM and Free Navigator 10. But unfortunately this good looking program doesn't contain maps for Martinique - yes, where are other islands from this region like Grenada.

Mapfactor: Can you convert Martinique and if possible St. Lucia and St Vincent-Grenadines ?

I will be grateful smile

Marcin

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#41 2010-12-20 09:32:02

nafg
Member
Registered: 2010-12-09
Posts: 8

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

mapfactor wrote:
nafg wrote:

Ah, but this is for Windows Mobile. Does that mean it's not possible with most devices? Besides the fact that most WM devices don't actually include the Speech API, I tried both "Locale Default" and "Synthetized English" and they didn't work; only MapFactor Lotta worked.

That's strange - "Synthetized English" should work for all: PC, PDA and PND (that's the reason why we did it, so it is not dependent on windows Speech API). Could you send me navigator.log.txt? Can somebody else confirm that behavior? (the latest tested version was 10.1.35)

Hmm. Now it seems to be working (at least when simulating a route). However, after switching from Lotta to Synthetized (it didn't ask to restart), the sound effect when you change the volume, and the spoken announcements such as recalculating route, were not heard. Also the Synthetized speech is pretty choppy, and it reads "st." either as "saint" or as "Ssst" (not sure which), and "ave." as if it were an unabreviated word.

Another thing. Go to New Jersey, follow the Garden State Parkway, after it crosses the Raritan River. Slightly above the river is a huge maze of exits and ramps and highways. Navigator does not seem to be able to figure out how to get from the GSP onto Route 440 to get to the Outerbridge Crossing into Staten Island, without going in an extremely roundabout way.
On a related note, when you have such situations with highways going in two directions, and more importantly when you have a cluster of crisscrossing roads, it should make this more clear, such as by drawing outlines and arrows.
You can see what I'm talking about at: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=40.52 … 6&layers=M

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#42 2010-12-20 16:04:28

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
Website

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

RGPS wrote:

Question: I don't have the Japan OSM on list and on the world OSM... ? it's normal ?

You are right - Japan is missing in the list of available MCA files. There was a bug in processing (found & fixed today), so I have ver0 of Japan now, but ... there are two things to fix (from MapFactor side):
1) the coast line is not fully integrated in earth_osm.mca, so you would see blue background (sea)
2) Japan characters are replaced by space (similar problem is in China)

From the OSM point of view I see many towns named "_edit_me_".

p.s. I will upload the data so I'll see what I am writing about ...

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#43 2010-12-21 04:31:20

nm7s9
Member
Registered: 2008-08-15
Posts: 12

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Hi,

I've been using Navigator 10 FREE now for a few days on a Garmn/Asus Nuvifone M10 (Windows Mobile 6.5 professional) and it works really well.

Ok - some comments/wishlists....

I've noticed that turn restrictions (no right turn) do not work in my neighbourhood, but I'm not sure if this will be corrected in a subsequent dataset of if maybe the relation is incorrect.

I'd like the program to announce which number road is the next one to turn into, Eg "In 500 metres take the second left into Smith Street".   (or the "next" left as appropriate).

I really like the "clockface" arrow that indicates the angle that the roundabout exit road makes to the current
direction of travel. However I'm one person that doesn't like to look at the display while driving and (though I've never seen it on any sat-nav system), I'd love an option to turn on which would result (for example) in the
announcement...

"In 500 Metres at the roundabout, take the second exit at 2 O'Clock.

Regarding the routing, this program, like nearly all the others tries constantly to get you back to the original route when you take a wrong turn, rather than caculating a best route from your new position.  My Garmin 3790T is the only one I've seen recaculate the new best route and that really impresses me.

I love the journey track saving option but think it could be improved by

a)  allow the entire current journey to be shown on the display,
b)  allow old journeys to be also shown (in either the same or different colours)
c)  allow the NMEA tracks to be exported to GPX.

I sometimes like to see old tracks so that when I am mapping a whole town/village, I can see which roads I've missed.

Do you know if this program will be available unders Windows Phone 7?  Does this depend on whether Microsoft make .NET framework available for this.   If I can run Navigator 10 FREE and BASIC4PPC on Phone 7 then I'll upgrade immediately.

The synthasised voice works perfectely although it would be nice to be able to edit the pronunciations.

There were a couple dubious routing announcements but these may be data errors and I will investigate further.

From my own situation, I'd like to see address search use admin level 6 (town/city in my case) rather than 10 (suburb) but maybe there could be an option to select between town search or suburb search.

PS I'd be more than happy to pay for a program with all these features but I do want my free/accurate/up-to-date OSM maps

Cheers
Nick

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#44 2010-12-21 09:58:45

mapfactor
Member
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
Website

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

marcinz wrote:

Mapfactor: Can you convert Martinique and if possible St. Lucia and St Vincent-Grenadines?

You should see Martinique on update now. An issue with "St. Lucia" is with ID (one version is st_lucia_osm and another is saint_lucia_osm) - we will verify all IDs (Setup Utility won't download MCA if ID is different).

-------
update: now both St Lucia as well as St Vincent-Grenadines are available - you will need to update Setup Utility to 10.1.21 and PC/Pocket Navigator to 10.1.37 in order to download and see the data.

Last edited by mapfactor (2010-12-23 16:35:51)

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#45 2010-12-21 10:10:49

mapfactor
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From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
Website

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

@nafg
The crossing is really pretty crazy - could you please give me exact coordinates for departure and destination points so I could easily reproduce it? (or just send me routing_points.xml file)
thanks
   Martin

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#46 2010-12-21 11:02:15

mapfactor
Member
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
Website

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Hi Nick,
thanks for your comments smile.

nm7s9 wrote:

I've noticed that turn restrictions (no right turn) do not work in my neighbourhood, but I'm not sure if this will be corrected in a subsequent dataset of if maybe the relation is incorrect.

I would need a coordinate of the junction (or better departure and destination coordinates near problematic area). As I wrote at the beginning of this post only simple restrictions are implemented.

I'd like the program to announce which number road is the next one to turn into, Eg "In 500 metres take the second left into Smith Street".   (or the "next" left as appropriate).

You should hear it but only with computer generated voice.

I really like the "clockface" arrow that indicates the angle that the roundabout exit road makes to the current
direction of travel. However I'm one person that doesn't like to look at the display while driving and (though I've never seen it on any sat-nav system), I'd love an option to turn on which would result (for example) in the
announcement...

"In 500 Metres at the roundabout, take the second exit at 2 O'Clock.

I will fwd this comment, thanks.

Regarding the routing, this program, like nearly all the others tries constantly to get you back to the original route when you take a wrong turn, rather than caculating a best route from your new position.  My Garmin 3790T is the only one I've seen recaculate the new best route and that really impresses me.

smile I hear usually the opposite, that it should return to original route instead of recalculating the route. It is recalculating, so if you put departure at given point you should see similar result - I write "similar", because during navigation it also takes into account your current direction of travel.

I love the journey track saving option but think it could be improved by
a)  allow the entire current journey to be shown on the display,
b)  allow old journeys to be also shown (in either the same or different colours)
c)  allow the NMEA tracks to be exported to GPX.

I sometimes like to see old tracks so that when I am mapping a whole town/village, I can see which roads I've missed.

These features rather fit in Map Explorer (different product) which is used for vehicle tracking, reports, etc.


Do you know if this program will be available unders Windows Phone 7?  Does this depend on whether Microsoft make .NET framework available for this.   If I can run Navigator 10 FREE and BASIC4PPC on Phone 7 then I'll upgrade immediately.

No (as far as I know).

From my own situation, I'd like to see address search use admin level 6 (town/city in my case) rather than 10 (suburb) but maybe there could be an option to select between town search or suburb search.

Can you be more specific? What country? We still discuss it on German forum (about Germany), so this part needs still some "tuning".


PS I'd be more than happy to pay for a program with all these features but I do want my free/accurate/up-to-date OSM maps

Thanks smile. At the end we still need some paying customers wink ...

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#47 2010-12-21 14:50:48

RGPS
Member
Registered: 2010-12-15
Posts: 15

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

mapfactor wrote:

Thanks smile. At the end we still need some paying customers wink ...

not a problem for me...but some "condition" to pay the product :

- update in realtime from OSM (download some specific area if you must use a preprocessor stage) and use immediatly. I don't want to wait 2 month to view and use my correction on OSM.

- low price (like 10 Euros or donator free profil like noniGPSplot for example)

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#48 2010-12-22 05:50:55

nm7s9
Member
Registered: 2008-08-15
Posts: 12

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

Thanks for the reply Martin,

The turn restriction that doesn't appear to work is....

No Right Turn
From -35.3446511, 149.2185807   (Uriarra Road)
Via  -35.3446643, 149.2183460   
To   -35.3431870, 149.2186082   (McKeahnie Street)

The town/suburb issue can be seen at

Australia, New South Wales, Queanbeyan  ( -35.3835340, 149.3067630 )
Admin Level 6 - City of Queanbeyan
Admin level 10 - Suburbs of Queanbeyan  (e.g. Greenleigh)

Since I don't like to take my eyes off the road while driving, I like the sat-nav to be very chatty. Here's an example.....

Driving north on 7th Street. The second road on the left is Main Street. Then I want to drive down Main Street and turn left into 2nd Street.

Navigator 10:

Carry on straight ahead
.
In 200 Metres turn left into Main Street
.
Turn left
.
Carry on straight ahead
.
900 metres from destination
.
Carry on straight ahead
.
Carry on straight ahead
.
500 Metres from destination
.
Carry on straight ahead
.
Carry on straight ahead
.
In 200 Metres turn left into 2nd Street
.
Turn Left
.
Arrive at Destination

--------------------
My ideal Chatty Mode would announce something like

IN 300 Metres take second left into Main Street
.
In 200 Metres take next left into Main Street
.
Turn Left
.
In 1 Kilometre takes 5th left into 2nd Street
.
In 800 Metres take 4th left into 2nd Street
.
In 500 Metres take 2nd left into 2nd Street
.
In 200 Metres take next left into 2nd Street
.
Turn Left into 2nd street
.
Turn Left
.
Arrive at destination in 60 Metres

Arrived at destination.

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#49 2010-12-22 16:44:16

mapfactor
Member
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 2010-11-12
Posts: 70
Website

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

nm7s9 wrote:

The turn restriction that doesn't appear to work is....

No Right Turn
From -35.3446511, 149.2185807   (Uriarra Road)
Via  -35.3446643, 149.2183460   
To   -35.3431870, 149.2186082   (McKeahnie Street)

You are right sad. I looked at http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/37693, that it is not "right turn" but "left turn", but ... there is a small portion of Uriarra Road, so from relation point of view it is like T-junction, and I have to check left/right. It should be working when both ways ends in "node via". Am I right that there is no solution when "node via" is for both ways somewhere in the middle?! (it is not this case)

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#50 2010-12-22 17:20:18

stephan75
Member
Registered: 2008-05-28
Posts: 2,802

Re: "free" Navigator 10 by mapfactor.com ... uses OSM data

mapfactor wrote:
nm7s9 wrote:

The turn restriction that doesn't appear to work is....

No Right Turn
From -35.3446511, 149.2185807   (Uriarra Road)
Via  -35.3446643, 149.2183460   
To   -35.3431870, 149.2186082   (McKeahnie Street)

You are right sad. I looked at http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/37693, that it is not "right turn" but "left turn", but ... there is a small portion of Uriarra Road, so from relation point of view it is like T-junction, and I have to check left/right. It should be working when both ways ends in "node via". Am I right that there is no solution when "node via" is for both ways somewhere in the middle?! (it is not this case)

There are even two turn restrictions in that area that need some tuning! Try to load that area in JOSM, before be sure that you have a recent version of the turn restriction plugin installed there. Each relation can be checked by the plugin ... and both relation are showing an error!

Martin's guess seems to be right: all the two ways of a turn restriction relation have to END UP in the via-node.

Who wants to try the fabulous turn restriction plugin in order to fix it? ;-)

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