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#1 2016-07-13 11:49:39

hsimpson
Member
Registered: 2015-07-21
Posts: 673

PT questions from Germany

Hi there,

I'm currently working on the public-transport-system in Aachen and I have some problems withe the bus-lines coming from the Netherlands.

There is one line, numer 50, coming from Maastricht to Aachen, which can't be used with german Tickets, but only with the OV-chipkaard.
Since there is also a line numeber 50 which can be used with german tickets, I need an network-value for the bus from Maastricht to state clear that can't be used with german Tickets.

The problem is, I couldn'd find any line in this area with a value for the network tag.

Do you use this tag in the Netherlands? And if yes, what are common values for this?

Comparin your system to the german, I would choose something like OV or OV-chipkaard for the value, because this would be the closest thing to the german networks (one network=one ticket), but if I try to understand this page, it could auso be the concession like "Concessie Zuid-Limburg": http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/NL-OV/Bus

Greetings,
hsimpson


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#2 2016-07-13 14:47:57

IIVQ
Member
Registered: 2014-11-12
Posts: 700

Re: PT questions from Germany

In the Netherlands, the "Network" is usually set by making a network-relations which contains all the route_masters or routes.

In this case, there is the network Concessie Zuid-Limburg that contains this route. The networks are the Concessions in which the Dutch public transport is divided.

However, in this case I wouldn't split the 50 into different route's, but instead include this route in both networks. Specifying payment options per route is stretching what should be included on OSM, besides is worthless if you don´t actually include the times.

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#3 2016-07-13 15:01:49

hsimpson
Member
Registered: 2015-07-21
Posts: 673

Re: PT questions from Germany

Hi, thank you for your answer!

That's interesting, because in germany we deleted all our budle-relations some time ago, because they became unnecessary and you can get the information much better by overpass-querys. Also they were never fully complete. And if you go to the german forum an suggest a bundle-relation, you will earn a massive shitstorm smile

So I will now set a network tag for every busline in the regio Aachen with "Concessie Zuid-Limburg" as value. Or do you habe a short version for this, like CSL?

Greetings


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#4 2016-07-13 22:09:01

IIVQ
Member
Registered: 2014-11-12
Posts: 700

Re: PT questions from Germany

Also, the OV-chipkaart is valid on the entirety of the Dutch public transport (with a few exceptions, such as on some ferries, on one of the islands and buses outside concessions, like flixbus. These used to be international buses but there are some intercity national buses, even for national trips)

In Germany it should be like that as well, something is not a network because one ticket is valid, but one ticket is valid because it is one network (concession)!

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#5 2016-07-13 22:16:03

hsimpson
Member
Registered: 2015-07-21
Posts: 673

Re: PT questions from Germany

In Germany we have much more concessions in one network. Espacially for the regional trains, there sometimes is only one concession for one or two lines. But there are also bus-systems with five ore more operators (sometimes two for the same line), Aachen for example.

But thank you for your explanation!


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#6 2016-07-14 10:01:40

IIVQ
Member
Registered: 2014-11-12
Posts: 700

Re: PT questions from Germany

Here it is the same:
Buses are mostly in regional concessions, sometimes an entire province, but the area around Amsterdam is divided into 5 separate concessions. Here you see a map, with the same colour denoting the same concession holder: http://www.treinreiziger.nl/userfiles/i … ekaart.JPG

For rail lines we have the "kernnet" (core network) which is run by the state-owned NS (Dutch Railways), and consists of all intercity lines and the local trains in the centre of the country.
The regional trains are mostly on lines where there is no intercity service, in the edges of the county, and usually consist of one or two lines.

Also for buses and trains the "brand" is a difficult case. For example, I work for Connexxion (a large bus operator, green in the map above), our native colour is green. But in some concessions the concessionaire has their own brand, such as "Breng" (Bring) and whoever runs it is required to sticker their buses/trains into the required colours.
Then there is R·NET, which is a brand of faster buses, on certain lines within certain concessions, which all have red/gray buses but are run by the local concessionholder.
Then there are also subcontractors, for example we Connexxion have certain buses run by tour operators. Sometimes they run with their own branded buses, sometimes with Connexxion-green buses.

Back to the Networks: In the Netherlands we group them by concession, but I intend to also create a few network relations based on formula (e.g. the fast R·NET buses), such that a route_master belongs to two networks at the same time.

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