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#126 2013-10-11 12:57:41

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Next release will handle some fallback to your crown_type definition with our actual models:

A or B -> deciduous
I -> palm
H -> conifer

We may add more model shape in the futur.

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#127 2013-10-11 13:20:52

kocio
Administrator
From: Warszawa
Registered: 2013-09-04
Posts: 3,565
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Hi,

I made a 3D model of ORCO Tower in Warsaw:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/3190068

While Kendzi3D shows it correctly, the F4 has some (like half =} ) completely missing parts and some other visible in a strange way (for example http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/237160224 in some direction has the walls, but only from inside - outside they're invisible). Is this the problem with the renderer or maybe with the model?

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#128 2013-10-11 13:23:11

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

I used successfull different tree geometries for city modelling already 2004:

Some cadastrial offices have databases with trees |type definiton | width | estimated height | position.
Just ask. They have often only excel sheet and provide such models.
If You do more different tree models, your visualization could be interesting for dendrology students. They have no tools for visualization and during of practical work collects such information...

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#129 2013-10-11 13:31:38

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

kocio wrote:

Hi,

I made a 3D model of ORCO Tower in Warsaw:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/3190068

While Kendzi3D shows it correctly, the F4 has some (like half =} ) completely missing parts and some other visible in a strange way (for example http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/237160224 in some direction has the walls, but only from inside - outside they're invisible). Is this the problem with the renderer or maybe with the model?

You are using "building:max_level(s)" but this tag is not defined in the specification, you must use building:levels instead to get something right.

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#130 2013-10-11 21:25:06

kocio
Administrator
From: Warszawa
Registered: 2013-09-04
Posts: 3,565
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

cmif4 wrote:

You are using "building:max_level(s)" but this tag is not defined in the specification, you must use building:levels instead to get something right.

Thanks for your quick response and the hint! I repaired all the tags and will look at the rendering when the data in F4 will refresh. I don't know how to be sure the changes are in effect, but F4 tends to be refreshed pretty fast.

However that still doesn't explain the problem, since the main tower was badly tagged the same way as the others, but this one is visible, while few others weren't. So the real problem has to be something else than the tag you suggested. And there are two more parts, which has another issue: they are displayed, but incorrectly (one of the walls is "translucid" from the outside but "solid" from the inside - I can look inside because of the missing roof). Which suggests me we have at least two problems, putting the "building:max_level(s)" tag aside.

(If you want to know exactly which parts are invisible and which are badly rendered, just let me know here.)

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#131 2013-10-12 13:31:40

things-change
Member
Registered: 2011-10-27
Posts: 351

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

hy, this looks a bit weird:

http://map.f4-group.com/#lat=52.2186822 … hi=-33.346

does it take more time to render the tiles, or does there excist an problem?

(I changed some amenity and surface tags there about a week ago)

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#132 2013-10-14 09:34:07

Cactusbone
Member
Registered: 2013-06-11
Posts: 110

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

tiles are cached for 1 day client side, 1 month server side. we seems to have some problems with server side tiles not expiring properly when an osm change occur, we're still working on it. what's the exact problem you're seeing ? taking a look at your url, I notice a white square near the rails but that's it.
Thanks for the feedback!

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#133 2013-10-14 10:37:27

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

cmif4,
please add a rendering cathegory
highway=traffic_island.

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#134 2013-10-14 11:39:33

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

According to taginfo this value is just a big mess, we would handle it if the contributor find a compromise on how to use it properly.

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#135 2013-10-14 13:59:39

things-change
Member
Registered: 2011-10-27
Posts: 351

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Cactusbone wrote:

...what's the exact problem you're seeing ? ...

The soccer field was partly rendered with 3 surfaces. Grass, sand and tartan. But since today it is ok.

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#136 2013-10-14 19:44:40

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

According to taginfo this value is just a big mess, we would handle it if the contributor find a compromise on how to use it properly.

Understand. Wait... wink

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#137 2013-10-15 10:00:34

Cactusbone
Member
Registered: 2013-06-11
Posts: 110

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

we've located our bug in tile expiration and i'm working on it smile

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#138 2013-10-22 07:07:34

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

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#139 2013-10-22 08:38:11

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

fix the bug:
building=commercial
I believe, there are some other values for building=* which are not rendered..
Regards,
Marek

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#140 2013-10-22 09:16:04

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

We handle every building tag value but "building=no".

The "round roof bug" is due to the roof modelling algorithm that is based on minimal oriented bounding box so for now it won't work on non rectangular shapes.

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#141 2013-10-22 09:42:50

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

building values:
look here: http://map.f4-group.com/#lat=48.1320774 … phi=-8.308

Let Your people adapt the algorithm for round roofs. This is often the case.

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#142 2013-10-22 09:53:53

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

These buildings have:
_ "building:part=yes" that means we should extrude them.
_ "building:parts=horizontal" that means we should skip the extrusion process.

I'm not a medium but i'm a lazy boy so the code take the easiest: do not extrude anything big_smile

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#143 2013-10-22 10:06:00

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

"building:parts=horizontal" that means we should skip the extrusion process

I can not understand this tagging. Do You understand what the artist mean? wink
I guess he wanted to show the horizontal stripes on the facade. For me very helpful feature for rendering of two colours in skyscapers.
Simply ignore building:parts=horizontal in recent form.

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#144 2013-10-22 10:12:22

things-change
Member
Registered: 2011-10-27
Posts: 351

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Or you use some parts with min_height and height tags like here:

http://map.f4-group.com/#lat=52.2228702 … hi=-67.666

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#145 2013-10-22 10:14:12

cmif4
Member
From: Paris
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 121
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Dinamik wrote:

Could you switch off volume rendering of building outlines (building=yes), which have tag building:parts (building:parts= ) and don't have tag building:part= (except building:part=no)? It can help to switch off volume rendering manually in cases, where tag building:parts had been already written by editor.

marek kleciak wrote:

Simply ignore building:parts=horizontal in recent form.

Please talk to each other then i'll may change the code roll

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#146 2013-10-22 11:54:10

marek kleciak
Member
Registered: 2010-10-11
Posts: 8,439

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Or even here: http://map.f4-group.com/#lat=52.4051450 … eta=50.518

This approach produces too much shapes and should be used only for irregular structures.
Please give me time for clear specification of this problem and I think, cmif4 can order the adding of this function for rendering.

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#147 2013-10-22 17:56:28

Dinamik
Member
Registered: 2010-08-12
Posts: 1,096

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

marek kleciak wrote:

"building:parts=horizontal" that means we should skip the extrusion process

I can not understand this tagging. Do You understand what the artist mean? wink
I guess he wanted to show the horizontal stripes on the facade. For me very helpful feature for rendering of two colours in skyscapers.
Simply ignore building:parts=horizontal in recent form.

cmif4 wrote:
Dinamik wrote:

Could you switch off volume rendering of building outlines (building=yes), which have tag building:parts (building:parts= ) and don't have tag building:part= (except building:part=no)? It can help to switch off volume rendering manually in cases, where tag building:parts had been already written by editor.

marek kleciak wrote:

Simply ignore building:parts=horizontal in recent form.

Please talk to each other then i'll may change the code roll

building:parts=... means, that it is building=..., which consists of several building:part=..., and we should skip volume rendering for such building=..., because we have several building:part=... for such purposes.

For example, this way now has:

building = commercial
building:part = yes
building:parts = horizontal

Such tagging is, obviously, incorrect.

Ignoring building:parts=horizontal is not a good idea. I think, that better idea is deletion of building:parts=horizontal from elements in OSM database, for which using of building:parts=horizontal is incorrect.

Last edited by Dinamik (2013-10-22 17:57:43)

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#148 2013-10-22 20:08:45

Tordanik
Moderator
From: Germany
Registered: 2008-06-17
Posts: 2,832
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Dinamik wrote:

building:parts=... means, that it is building=..., which consists of several building:part=..., and we should skip volume rendering for such building=..., because we have several building:part=... for such purposes.

This is redundant, though, because you could just look at the building:part=* polygons and their tags to find out whether they are arranged horizontally and/or vertically.

building:parts is basically your own invention and has not been discussed before it was presented in the wiki as if it was an established tag. Unfortunately, I still don't think it is useful. The name is also very typo-prone.


OSM in 3D: OSM2World

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#149 2013-10-22 20:30:47

Dinamik
Member
Registered: 2010-08-12
Posts: 1,096

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Let me say in other words. It is your decision, to use some tag for some your purposes or not. But if you see, that someone's work with incorrectly used tag leads to incorrect result, you can not say "ignore this tag", you should say "delete incorrectly used tag from database". In this concrete case we see incorrectly used tag - the reason of incorrect rendering is not in bad tag, but namely in incorrect using of tag.

For example, we have tag natural=water for water areas. It is your decision, to render it in some way or not. But if someone asks "why does this soccer pitch render as blue area in this render?" and you see, that pitch is tagged with natural=water, you can not say to author of render "ignore tag natural=water, because it leads to mistakes", you should say to author of question "delete incorrectly used tag natural=water from pitch".

P. S. Not all software can determine buildings, divided to parts, by analyzing building:part= polygons. There is a software, which use tag building:parts for such determining. If tag can help some software in some cases, why should we consider it as a harmful?

Last edited by Dinamik (2013-10-22 20:38:06)

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#150 2013-10-22 21:49:13

Tordanik
Moderator
From: Germany
Registered: 2008-06-17
Posts: 2,832
Website

Re: Real time 3D map using WebGL

Dinamik wrote:

Let me say in other words. It is your decision, to use some tag for some your purposes or not. But if you see, that someone's work with incorrectly used tag leads to incorrect result, you can not say "ignore this tag", you should say "delete incorrectly used tag from database". In this concrete case we see incorrectly used tag - the reason of incorrect rendering is not in bad tag, but namely in incorrect using of tag.

A tag shouldn't be ignored because it is sometimes used incorrectly. You are right about that.

The reason why I suggest to ignore building:parts=* is different, however: Because it is redundant, and burdens mappers with a task that should be done by computers.

P. S. Not all software can determine buildings, divided to parts, by analyzing building:part= polygons. There is a software, which use tag building:parts for such determining. If tag can help some software in some cases, why should we consider it as a harmful?

There are other reasons to determine the parts belonging to a building. For example, the parts are generally understood to "inherit" attributes such as colour from the building. Furthermore, placing parts without grouping them to a building will also cause problems if you place them on a terrain surface, which would introduce unpredictable vertical shifts. So the tag does not actually free software from that task (and even if it did, I would still consider it questionable to trade mappers' time for CPU cycles in this manner).


OSM in 3D: OSM2World

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