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#1 2012-02-25 19:15:11

stephankn
Moderator
Registered: 2010-05-04
Posts: 624

Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

Hi,

we have a large number of ways in Bangkok that are created by user amai.

He declined the contributor terms, thus ODbL.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/amai/diary

I asked him if he could consider donating his Thailand edits so we can keep it under ODbL.
Unfortunately he did not respond yet.

I would like to remove the ways he created from aerials so we can focus on the important remapping parts. Ways to be removed would be those that are still in version 1 and contain no tag that needs ground survey.

Any objectives? If not I would execute the job next weekend.

Stephan

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#2 2012-02-26 06:27:18

Willi2006
Member
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand
Registered: 2009-12-12
Posts: 421
Website

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

No objection. I remapped already some of them a while ago where I happened to have been. But I don't map anymore where I never was. Several times I experienced that I did it wrong when I mapped from Bing only without having been there.

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#3 2012-02-26 12:35:01

Bernhard Hiller
Member
Registered: 2011-05-10
Posts: 1,066

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

Do you want to start re-mapping that area already now? If so: yes, delete it, and re-map it. If not, I'd prefer those data to remain - we can still use it till 1st of April, and our maps are a little more "complete" meanwhile.

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#4 2012-03-01 08:22:13

stephankn
Moderator
Registered: 2010-05-04
Posts: 624

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

Hi,

I highly appreciate the huge contribution amai did to Thailand. Unfortunately he decided that the way OSM is developing is not his way.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/amai/diary/14103
We now need to deal with the loss that will be caused by him leaving.

After the weekend we roughly have three weeks left until the license change. In my opinion having residential roads without a name for three weeks does not provide a huge benefit. @Bernhard: For what would you like to actually use it?

The problem I want to address is that we do not see the real critical data we need to remap because so much data is affected.

A simple example: amai created a way from bing. Later a local mapper added more tags, for example a street name. Or a oneway restriction.
As the way is not clean it will not be part of the ODbL planet after the license change. Then also the tags created with local knowledge will be lost.

I would like to remove all of his edits that still exist with him as the only editor and containing no tags that need local knowledge.

The left-over data will be the data we need to focus on the next weeks.

I agree that this will create a gap in Bangkok. Many highway=residential will be gone. And I by myself certainly can't redraw 10.000 ways in the next weeks as I have an office Job. Redrawing this amount from aerials is roughly 80 hours of effort.

I still believe that protecting local knowledge tags from deletion is of a much higher priority. We can't get back that information from armchair mapping.

Please give your vote until the weekend. I won't do the deletion without agreement from the community.

By looking at the "Badmap" you can get a rough idea of what is affected:
http://cleanmap.poole.ch/?zoom=11&lat=1 … ayers=00B0

most of these residential roads are created by amai from aerials.

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#5 2012-03-01 08:54:15

Beddhist
Member
From: Doembang Nangbuat, TH
Registered: 2009-07-28
Posts: 435
Website

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

For the sake of a more complete map I agree.

Rant: this is precisely why I objected to this whole licence change and the way it was handled in the first place. I can understand amai's sentiment. I wonder how big the mess will be in the more densely mapped countries? Back to my day job... roll

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#6 2012-03-01 18:14:18

Bernhard Hiller
Member
Registered: 2011-05-10
Posts: 1,066

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

Looks like Bangkok was Amai's main area. It will quite empty...
OK, let's start, delete that.

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#7 2012-03-03 01:29:00

stephankn
Moderator
Registered: 2010-05-04
Posts: 624

Re: Non ODbL content in Bangkok area

Thanks for the feedback. I additionally received agreement by OSM messages. A strong majority of over 70% (based on node data) of Thailand mappers agreed to the deletion. This gives me hope we can manage to remap the area in the next weeks.

I removed objects after manual inspection. It's all in changeset 10853338. The following filters had been used to select problematic ways:

user:amai version:1 type:way highway=residential source=* tags:2
user:amai version:1 type:way building=yes source=* tags:2
user:amai version:1 type:way building=yes source=* highway=*
user:amai version:1 type:way building=yes source=*
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=residential tags:1
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=residential source=* bridge? tags:3
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=unclassified source=* tags:2
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=tertiary source=* tags:2
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=tertiary source=* tags:3 bridge?
user:amai version:1 type:way highway=unclassified source=* tags:3 bridge?

ways that match filter and are created by decliner according to quick history service
user:amai tags:-2 highway=residential -name=* -"name:en"=* -surface=* -oneway=*
user:amai tags:2 highway=unclassified source=*
user:amai highway=residential bridge?
user:amai highway=unclassified bridge? -surface
user:amai highway=tertiary bridge? -name=* -oneway=* -ref=* -"name:en"=*
user:amai highway=tertiary source=* tags:2
user:amai tags:1 (highway=residential OR highway=unclassified OR highway=tertiary)
user:amai -highway=* type:way building=* source=* tags:2
user:amai waterway=* -name=* -"name:en"=* -boat=* -width=*
user:amai tags:-2 (highway=road OR highway=service) -"name:en"
user:amai tags:-4 (highway=road OR highway=service) -"name:en" -access=* -junction=* -oneway=*

About 1500 problematic ways remain. These need closer inspection and remapping. Also a lot of nodes still exist in other ways and should be replaced by a clean version. When using Bing pay attention to a possible offset of the images.

OSMI is soon updated to reflect the change.
http://tools.geofabrik.de/osmi/?view=wt … ne_created



Stephan

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